2gig to qolsys?

how would you recommend doing the cost-benefit analysis of converting from my current 2gig gc 2 (which has a combination of wireless sensors and a takeover module of a wired system) to a qolsys (which appears to be your currently recommended system)?

my current system functions fine. however, i would like to add shock sensors to the window and doors, and need to determine whether i should go ahead and do that with the current system or convert to qolsys (which would be much more costly since all sensors would need to be replaced). i also know the 3g radio will need to be replaced with a 4g soon. if my current system meets my needs, it seems encryption is the main benefit of switching to qolsys? how do you suggest valuing that functionality? how common is defeat of security systems by signal jamming? are there other considerations?

We do recommend the Qolsys IQ Panel 2+ as it offers 4G LTE, Z-Wave plus, a DSC PowerG radio along with built in broadband.

There are a few different models of the IQ Panel 2+. The version on our storefront includes a 319.5MHz radio for communication with Legacy Qolsys and GE brand wireless sensors as well as Qolsys S-Line encrypted sensors and includes a 4G LTE module on the Verizon network.

However, we also offer a version that has a 345MHz radio instead, for communication with 2GIG and Honeywell sensors (instead of the 319.5Mhz radio). A 4G LTE module on the Verizon network is also included.

When using this version, you would not need to replace 345MHz wireless sensors and it will work with the 2GIG TAKE-345 for hardwired takeover (assuming thats what you are currently using)

i would like to add shock sensors to the window and doors

The PowerG Shock Sensor works with the IQ Panel 2+ if you go that route.

, it seems encryption is the main benefit of switching to qolsys?

Encryption is a a big difference. Also the use of PowerG sensors (encrypted and offer a much longer ranger of communication)

how common is defeat of security systems by signal jamming? are there other considerations?

While it is rare and takes special equipment to do, it is possible to spoof transmitter ids of standard legacy sensors

Encrypted sensors are objectively more secure than unencrypted sensors, and Power G sensors are objectively more secure than S-Line with their added frequency hopping.

Power G sensors utilize encrypted, multichannel, frequency hopping spread spectrum RF. They represent the gold standard for wireless security.

are there other considerations?

IQP2+ also offers video to the panel with some Alarm.com cameras, including the SkyBell.

The panel is objectively more user friendly when it comes to navigation and programming as well.

what is the broadband used for?

i’ve seen your recommendation of the dw10-5150 for 2gig systems. i thought i remember (but can’t find) a similar recommendation in this forum for a similar setup that is compatible with qolsys - if that’s the case, how would you compare that setup with the power g shock sensor?

the current system actually has two translators - an RE108 and RE224.

correct me if i’m wrong but i see two options if changing to an iq2 panel:

i could replace the two existing translators with a IQ hardwire 16F. in this case, i would need the 319.5 iq2 panel, and would need to replace my existing wireless 2gig and honeywell wireless sensors with either s-line or power g sensors. or is there a translator that will convert a hardwire system to power g signals? how much more secure is power g encryption compared to s-line, if that can be quantified?

a second option would be to keep my existing setup (or replace the two existing translators with a take-345), in which case i would need a 345 mhz iq2 panel. in this case, i could keep all existing sensors, but 1) the converted hardwire signals won’t be encrypted and 2) my choices for future sensors would be limited to power g. i assume power g is more expensive - aside from cost, are there other reasons i might want to have the option to use s-line (e.g. more variety of sensors available, etc)?

what is the broadband used for?

Wifi connection is used for dual path communication with Alarm.com, and is used for local connection to secondary keypads if applicable.

i’ve seen your recommendation of the dw10-5150 for 2gig systems. i thought i remember (but can’t find) a similar recommendation in this forum for a similar setup that is compatible with qolsys - if that’s the case, how would you compare that setup with the power g shock sensor?

I would recommend going with the PowerG option due to the added benefits of encryption, range, spread-spectrum frequency hopping rf.

i could replace the two existing translators with a IQ hardwire 16F. in this case, i would need the 319.5 iq2 panel, and would need to replace my existing wireless 2gig and honeywell wireless sensors with either s-line or power g sensors. or is there a translator that will convert a hardwire system to power g signals? how much more secure is power g encryption compared to s-line, if that can be quantified?

I believe a PowerG version was in the works, but it is not available and I do not have any ETA or confirmation.

S-Line is an encrypted rf protocol and highly recommended. It is objectively more secure than an unencrypted option, protecting against spoofing.

PowerG is objectively more secure, with spread-spectrum frequency hopping.

i assume power g is more expensive - aside from cost, are there other reasons i might want to have the option to use s-line (e.g. more variety of sensors available, etc)?

PowerG has more variety, actually, and the cost difference is definitely there, though not as extreme as you might think.

Ultimately I would consider replacing the double translation set-up you are describing and use a Hardwire 16F. It should prove to be more reliable, more secure, and easier to troubleshoot.

Also, the 319.5 version of the IQ panel 2+ is a bit cheaper than the 345Mhz version, which offsets the cost.

what’s the difference between the small and large enclosure options, and how would one choose which to use?

it looks like the power g shock sensor is a combination contact and shock sensor and the installation instructions say the sensor is mounted on the stationary door frame, rather than on the glass - how does the effectiveness of this compare to glass-mounted shock sensors, such as the honeywell 5800ss1 or the interlogix 5150? will a 3-4 in wooden frame around the glass pane affect the effectiveness of detecting the glass breaking? if there are two glass panes that require protecting (the sliding glass door itself and a stationary pane of the same size over which the door slides), would a single power g shock sensor effectively monitor breaking of either of the two glass panes, or would each pane require its own sensor? why would you recommend the power g shock sensor over a power g contact sensor - on-glass shock sensor combo (such as, for example, a 5150 wired to a PG9945)?

PowerG Curtain PIR Motion Detector

are these meant to be enrolled as perimeter sensors? if so, how would you compare the effectiveness of using one of these to protect all of the windows and doors on a common wall to placing shock sensors on each window and door?

IQ Glass Break Detector

i assume these are not ideal for windows and doors covered by shades and curtains?

what’s the difference between the small and large enclosure options, and how would one choose which to use?

The small option contains just the HW16F shown here. The Large option is the HW16F mounted inside a larger enclosure which has room to mount a second HW16F and backup batteries.

You would use the large enclosure if you wanted the cabinet it comes with, or if you wanted a nice way of organizing 2 separate HW16s.

This video from Qolsys shows off the Large enclosure.

it looks like the power g shock sensor is a combination contact and shock sensor and the installation instructions say the sensor is mounted on the stationary door frame, rather than on the glass - how does the effectiveness of this compare to glass-mounted shock sensors, such as the honeywell 5800ss1 or the interlogix 5150?

The PowerG PG9935 is a good choice for a door/window that you want to monitor for vibration and opening/closing the door. I have not been able to directly compare to the ss1 or 5150 but specs for vibration are similar. You will want to test locally to determine efficacy however.

PowerG Curtain PIR Motion Detector
are these meant to be enrolled as perimeter sensors? if so, how would you compare the effectiveness of using one of these to protect all of the windows and doors on a common wall to placing shock sensors on each window and door?

Yes, they could be learned in as perimeter senors. Shock sensors would detect intrusion before the motion would in this case.

IQ Glass Break Detector
i assume these are not ideal for windows and doors covered by shades and curtains?

Thats a fair assumption to make, depending on the thickness of the curtain. Glassbreaks are useful but I wouldnt use them as the first/only line of defense, especially when thick curtains are involved. Local testing of devices/scenarios is always recommended.

Sorry if I missed it but how would you compare the PG9935 with a PG9945-5150 combo in terms of effectiveness and functionality? I believe both would provide both open/close as well as shock detection, but would the PG9945-5150 combo generally be expected to provide more reliable shock protection by virtue of the fact that the shock sensor is mounted directly on the glass? Or would the two options be expected to provide similar reliability?

Is this what we are looking for? https://www.dsc.com/index.php?n=products&o=view&id=2688

can the small enclosure be installed within an existing metal (rather than plastic) can, or will the metal interfere with signaling?

can the IQ2+ panel be mounted inside a closet to avoid revealing the system type to visitors? would that interfere with proper functioning, aside from muffling the siren?

Is this what we are looking for?

Yes, I think that will be supported soon, but it is not yet supported by the Qolsys panel. I’ll check with Qolsys but I don’t think there is an ETA yet.

Sorry if I missed it but how would you compare the PG9935 with a PG9945-5150 combo in terms of effectiveness and functionality?

I would recommend the PG9935, rated for up to 4 x 8 foot frames.

can the small enclosure be installed within an existing metal (rather than plastic) can, or will the metal interfere with signaling?

Yes, it was made for that. The rigid transmission antenna is intended to be run out through a hole in the metal can.

can the IQ2+ panel be mounted inside a closet to avoid revealing the system type to visitors? would that interfere with proper functioning, aside from muffling the siren?

Depending on construction and what is in the closet no, you shouldn’t see a big impact, unless the other option is far away from the closet.

An Anker bluetooth speaker can be added for remote voice annunciations, chimes, and two way voice, but I wouldn’t recommend using 2 way voice if you do this because the panel mic would still be used and will make it difficult for operators to hear you.

will a single PG9935 protect both glass panes in the sliding window and door in the hypothetical image below as long as W and H are no more than 4’ and 8’ respectively? does the PG9935 ship with a magnet? i assume open/close and shock are programmed into different loops?

how much more technical knowledge and hardware is required to defeat power g compared to s line signals? are there many known examples of s-line systems that were breached where power g would have not have been? trying to get a sense of whether its worth waiting for a power g translator to become available, although i would prefer the 16 zones on the hardwire 16 compared to the 8 on the PG9WLSHW8.

would an anker bluetooth speaker broadcast the siren when the alarm is activated? does the IQ siren broadcast chimes? what’s the best solution to get both chimes and siren amplified?

will a single PG9935 protect both glass panes in the sliding window and door in the hypothetical image below as long as W and H are no more than 4’ and 8’ respectively? does the PG9935 ship with a magnet?

The PG9935 is meant to be mounted on an monitor a door frame of 7 to 8ft in height and 1 to 4 ft in length. It is meant to monitor any glass within that parameter as well.

While one PG9935 may cover the entirety of the sliding glass door in the picture, you may need two sensors for each part of the door.

Additionally, the sliding door itself may inadvertently trigger the shock sensor when opening/closing. Local testing would be advised in this case.

It does include a magnet

how much more technical knowledge and hardware is required to defeat power g compared to s line signals? are there many known examples of s-line systems that were breached where power g would have not have been?

Couldn’t say as we have not seen any examples of either S-Line or PowerG being defeated.

Would an anker bluetooth speaker broadcast the siren when the alarm is activated?

Bluetooth speaker with the panel is used for remote voice annunciations, chimes and two-way voice. I do not believe it works with the siren (don’t have one to test. ) will reach out to Qolsys and confirm if that has changed.

what’s the best solution to get both chimes and siren amplified?

You could use the Anker speaker for Chimes and a separate z-wave siren, like the IQ Siren QZ2300-840, for alarm events.

thanks

what is the significance of this possibility? wouldn’t both the shock and open/close loops be enrolled as perimeter sensors, so either way one wouldn’t really care what triggers the alarm whether an intruder enters by opening the door or breaking the glass? or am i missing something?

Would an anker bluetooth speaker broadcast the siren when the alarm is activated?

Confirmed with Qolsys, this does not trigger the Siren through the Anker speaker.

what is the significance of this possibility?

Correct, apologies, you shoudln’t have to worry about that as you would program that type of sensor as Door/Window-M, Group 13 Instant Perimeter D/W.

You would just need to test to determine if one centrally located sensor would cover both sides of the sliding glass door.

great thanks

Why is surety recommending Qolsys over 2gig?

Because we feel that Qolsys is currently the best experience with an Alarm.com compatible alarm panel, with the easiest programming, the most rapid development, the widest and most secure set of available sensors, and access to features no other panels in the ecosystem offer. Here’s another description of the difference.

Conversely 2GIG has left some frustrating and questionable bugs present in the GC3, which despite 2 years of numerous and frequent reports and complaints from multiple dealers, have gone unresolved through 4 subsequent firmware releases.

The GC2 and GC3 are still solid platforms, but development has slowed and the panels were replaced by the GC2e and GC3e. These encrypted models improve security by using encrypted sensors, but the GC3e still has the same fundamental firmware problems because it shares firmware with the regular GC3.

Nick, thank you for a very complete answer. I was thinking of upgrading my GC2 and may now want to consider Qolsys. After skimming the posts, am I correct to state that I can but a new Main and remote panel and keep all my 2 Gig sensors (contact and motion) and all my Zwave devices (Linear Garage DOor, Kwickset locks, Schlage locks)?

Yes, but you would need to make sure to get the correct version. There are three different radio models of the IQ Panel 2+. You would need the 345Mhz legacy radio version found here.

If I ordered the Legacy version, would that mean I would lose some features from the standard version? In short, does it do everything the standard version does? Encryption (if I by encrypted senors going forward for example)

There are three versions, all three have the PowerG radio for encrypted, spread-spectrum frequency hopping sensors (basically the top industry option), then each has one legacy radio, either 319.5 (GE, S-Line), 345 (2GIG, Honeywell), or 433 (DSC).

The only thing you lose is access to the other legacy sensor types, the big one being S-Line encrypted sensors, but you only get one no matter the model you choose, and if upgrading sensors I would recommend PowerG anyway as they have the best security and feature set.